anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Discuss autism diets and biomedical treatments of autism.

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JeniB
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anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby JeniB » Thu Sep 13, 2012 9:46 pm

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mimicry
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby mimicry » Thu Sep 13, 2012 9:53 pm

I do approx 1200iu a day, but not this high. I probably should since my D was abysmally low when I was pregnant, and while I did give him drops while I was nursing, I had lapses of forgetting it.

The co-factors (magnesium, zinc and K) are also ones we've got the biggest bang from.

fiveyearswasted
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby fiveyearswasted » Thu Sep 13, 2012 10:29 pm

We've used Biotech Pharmacal 50,000iu a few times: http://www.biotechpharmacal.com/catalog ... vitamin-d/
Checked my son's Vit D levels after and his D2+D3 was 61 (high normal limit is 80).

I've tried the Stoss Therapy protocol of one 50,000iu cap per week for 7 weeks. Couldn't really tell any difference other than my skin appears less transparent, like the "white" is thicker, don't see veins as much.

This is one of the most important factors to check in autism since it is depleted by pathogens which results in high blood serum calcium amongst other problems.
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JeniB
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby JeniB » Thu Sep 13, 2012 10:43 pm

I kept reading on his site, some good info. I remember coming across it a long time ago and my son matched some of the deficiency symptoms with weakness. (he had a bad fall that produced loose bone on his forehead when he was under two, it never healed). Anyway, I never got brave enough to supplement the levels he talked about for too long. AND I was using vitamin A most of the time. It seems that he tries to get levels to 100-150 for autistics. That something is going wrong with how they process vitamin D. I don't hear anything about parents going after this route much. Would be interesting to see if he's really onto something with this. And that most of us would not see results due to all the heavy preaching of vitamin A for so long.

I think, something, is manipulating Alkaline phosphatase (sp?). I think you get this from vitamin d and I'm also thinking thiamine. Both control phosphorus to some degree and the body uses it to douse acids in the body. (my son seems to need lots of thiamine and his teeth are very white now, compared to the off and on again greyish color they almost always had). He is doing SO well with thiamine. But needs lots of it, which has me scratching my head wondering why? As if something is eating it up too. yay. :(

I have also found some really fascinating info on microsporidia in honeybees and it being responsible for the colony collapse of many bee's that we see happening now. how this organism is turning off the AP in the body in a way, tricking the immune system to let it flourish, which would be the vitamin D receptor...interesting. I'm thinking many autistics have this infection. Going undetected.

Also, on Cannell's site I caught that zinc turns on the vitamin D receptor (I remember reading this a long time ago and have totally forgotten it!). Which would explain why getting copper out has helped my son so much...and could be part to blame for the rise in autsim as well. It does no good to get your vitamin D at a swimming pool only to have copper absorbed through your skin and prevent it from even working! My son tans much better now, and seriously looked very similar to the picture of the boy in the second article I posted. Very thin and weak. and pale.
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mimicry
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby mimicry » Thu Sep 13, 2012 10:45 pm

When I broke my foot a couple years ago. (should have been a strained or torn tendon, but my bones were so weak that the tendon just broke the bone off and stayed intact). They finally got around to testing. My original blood level of d was 20. After two rounds of 50.000 iu protocols (I think 8 weeks each time) my level only raised to 24. Doing my own protocol of 10iu a day of D3 I got it up into the 60s.

The prescription 50k iu were utter crap for me. That's because most of the time they are d2, which is not what you need to supplement.

Although I don't always agree with Mercola, he's right on this one.

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/artic ... ments.aspx

JeniB
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby JeniB » Thu Sep 13, 2012 10:48 pm

I'm going to try it on myself this week. I've been sleeping like crap lately and I'm going to see if this helps. I had a friend that was having serious sleep issues and went to a sleep clinic, found out she was low in vitamin D. Started sleeping like a baby after taking vitamin D. and started tanning too...where before she was ghost white.
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby JeniB » Thu Sep 13, 2012 10:51 pm

my mom has those grey teeth too now, and horrible arthritis. She recently had two teeth break off as well :shock: She had always had beautiful white teeth her whole life, not a single cavity...then she just went downhill. She had a copper iud prior to deciding to have my sister. After that she developed chronic fatique and digestive issues, insomnia and then arthritis. I think it's an infection doing this. She also got bit by a spider or "something" that she never had treated. Her hand turned black for a month in that spot. That's when the arthritis got really bad.
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LittleBirdsLoved
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby LittleBirdsLoved » Fri Sep 14, 2012 3:24 pm

MTS
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mimicry
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby mimicry » Fri Sep 14, 2012 5:14 pm

Did you spend alot of time at the ocean too Doe? Could be the iodine and magnesium in the seawater.

dabaxter
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby dabaxter » Fri Sep 14, 2012 6:57 pm

Thanks for posting this. I think we got away from Vit D supplementatio due to his levels being in the normal range.
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Dani
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby Dani » Fri Sep 14, 2012 7:33 pm

mimicry wrote:When I broke my foot a couple years ago. (should have been a strained or torn tendon, but my bones were so weak that the tendon just broke the bone off and stayed intact). They finally got around to testing. My original blood level of d was 20. After two rounds of 50.000 iu protocols (I think 8 weeks each time) my level only raised to 24. Doing my own protocol of 10iu a day of D3 I got it up into the 60s.

The prescription 50k iu were utter crap for me. That's because most of the time they are d2, which is not what you need to supplement.

Although I don't always agree with Mercola, he's right on this one.

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/artic ... ments.aspx


How long did it take to get your D3 levels to the 60s?
I didn't know how strong I could be until I had to be.

mimicry
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby mimicry » Sat Sep 15, 2012 5:56 am

Dani wrote:
mimicry wrote:When I broke my foot a couple years ago. (should have been a strained or torn tendon, but my bones were so weak that the tendon just broke the bone off and stayed intact). They finally got around to testing. My original blood level of d was 20. After two rounds of 50.000 iu protocols (I think 8 weeks each time) my level only raised to 24. Doing my own protocol of 10iu a day of D3 I got it up into the 60s.

The prescription 50k iu were utter crap for me. That's because most of the time they are d2, which is not what you need to supplement.

Although I don't always agree with Mercola, he's right on this one.

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/artic ... ments.aspx


How long did it take to get your D3 levels to the 60s?


I can't remember, but I think around 6 months, versus the 4 that I had done the prescription d and only raised 4 points.

JeniB
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby JeniB » Sat Sep 15, 2012 6:24 am

getting levels up to 100-150 for autistics seems to be what he's recommending. Why, exactly, I wonder that vitamin D is becoming so hard to raise? We don't get gains during the summer (but we also live in a moldy area). It may be because of the copper still...which was high for us, and zinc not turning on VitD receptor. But, I do wonder why it takes so much supplementation to have effect....is it working more as an anti-inflammatory? or is something messing up how our kids are getting or processing their vitamin D?
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JeniB
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby JeniB » Sat Sep 15, 2012 7:42 am

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2009/apr ... n-D_01.htm

here's a link I found iin the first link that's good

Calcitriol has nootropic properties—that is, it protects brain tissue by reducing inflammatory cytokine levels which, when elevated, are strongly associated with cognitive impairment.3,58 Calcitriol also protects brain tissue by stimulating production of neuro-trophins, chemicals that combat toxicity from a number of sources including toxic levels of intracellular brain calcium.59 Calcitriol also increases brain levels of glutathione,60,61 a powerful natural antioxidant that is the body’s most important tool for detoxifying and excreting heavy metals and that is rapidly consumed during oxidant stress from toxins and other sources.

Cannell argues convincingly that it is especially this calcitriol-induced increase in glutathione levels that can explain the link between autism and heavy metal toxicity.3,62 Heavy metals deplete intracellular glutathione,63 however, animals supplemented with calcitriol show a reduction in iron- and zinc-induced brain injury.64,65

A study by Dr. Jill James sheds further light on the connection between heavy metals, glutathione, and autism. Children with a variant of autism called regressive autism demonstrated a severe imbalance in the ratio of active to inactive glutathione, compared with healthy children. Regressive autism occurs when previously healthy children lose acquired language or behavioral skills and go on to develop autism. Children with regressive autism displayed chronically elevated levels of oxidative stress, which would make them more vulnerable to damaging neurotoxic agents such as heavy metals.66
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby JeniB » Sat Sep 15, 2012 7:49 am

lots of zinc supplementation without vitamin D could cause toxic levels of zinc and iron in the brain. The fact that vitamin D turns on brain glutathione should definitely make one take pause and notice...for sure. I'm kicking myself because this is something I had read around the time my son was 3.5 and he had symptoms of rickets too. knocked knees, large head and the bone fracture, from a simple fall, is still there on his forehead. A smallish chunck of bone :shock:

Dani, aren't you addressing vitamin D and how much have you been giving for how long? I remember you mentioning your daughter not being able to keep levels up. Gosh, Mimicry...you took 10,000iu for 6 months to get levels to 60? Makes me wonder about why some do horrible with fish oil too. The high amount of vitamin A in it. The copper theory along with this explains some things, for sure.
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JeniB
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby JeniB » Sat Sep 15, 2012 8:16 am

found this info about the honey bees dying...microsporidia and it's infection. How it down regulates the immune response. causing tissue damage in the gut. Other species of this infection (the one I think my son has from bunnies in our yard). Can pass from animals to humans. But doesn't kill it's host. The head tilt, is a neurological finding in rabbits. My son had this. Big time, It turns out when I research this infection, it affects the phosphate pathways the most. Here is a quote from the Bee article and I suggest reading the entire thing. It is very very informative. I personally think this is happening to many autistic children, especially those that don't show yeast on any stool sample (like mine). It is not tested for. By anyone that I know except in the AIDS community. Our kids also have immune dysregulation just as the people affected by AIDS....why no one has looked at this, I don't know. Because it is spore forming, hard to treat and causes damage to the CNS. It just comes back when you stop treatment. AGAIN, vets are much more up to date in their care and in solving these issues. They use Baytril/oxibendazole to stop the life cycle of this protozoa. With success. Even doctors treating humans haven't come across this novel treatment. also, vets are using lufenuron that is a chitin inhibitor. Do yourselves a favor and look up microsporidia and see what it does to the cells and it's effect on humans. I highly doubt that compromised immune systems are the only ones with this infection.

Finally, to further understand the pathological impact of the parasite, we measured the activity of the alkaline phosphatase (AP). Its biological role in insect gut is not well known. However, in mammals, the activity of the AP plays a pivotal role in gut health [38] since it is involved in the regulation of nutrient absorption [57], the detoxification of bacterial lipopolysaccharide [58], prevents bacterial invasion [59] and effectively reduces intestinal inflammation caused by bacteria [60]. In addition, there are numerous structural and functional homologies between insect and mammal APs [37]. Here, its activity was significantly decreased by N. ceranae (Figure 5, Mann-Whitney U test: p = 0.007), suggesting a reduction of gut protection or health. Similarly, Antunez et al. [9] found that this microsporidian induces an immune suppression in bees, which would affect the host susceptibility to others pathogens.


http://www.plosone.org/article/info%3Ad ... ne.0037017
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JeniB
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby JeniB » Sat Sep 15, 2012 8:40 am

check out this hand posturing from tetany!!!!

does THIS look familiar???? :shock:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trousseau_ ... ent_tetany

more good info
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetany

clostridia tetanai does this too
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momof6
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby momof6 » Sat Sep 15, 2012 8:52 am

Thanks for posting. I'm really curious about this myself. He makes a pretty bold statement at the very end. I've read Bock's book and McCandless' book and I still feel so dumb. I'm still new to biomed. We just saw the DAN and are just starting on basic supplements...multivitamin without copper, methyl b-12, cod liver oil with vit. e & K, GABA. We submitted all the baseline testing and we have a follow up in 6 weeks. At first, do I strictly follow the DANs initial supplement plan or could I harmlessly start adding things like this high dose vitamin d3 protocol and a HPU protocol? I'm so confused how you smart ladies are helping your children....mostly DAN recommendations or do you just read & treat yourselves? It sounds like you guys have chemistry backgrounds knowing all these vitamin and molecule pathways and precursors and which supplements need other supplements to work. I feel so dumb. I want to be aggressive with his treatment because he's 4 and we're just starting, but I don't want to add anything unsafe on my own. How do you guys know?
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mimicry
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby mimicry » Sat Sep 15, 2012 8:55 am

JeniB wrote:getting levels up to 100-150 for autistics seems to be what he's recommending. Why, exactly, I wonder that vitamin D is becoming so hard to raise? We don't get gains during the summer (but we also live in a moldy area). It may be because of the copper still...which was high for us, and zinc not turning on VitD receptor. But, I do wonder why it takes so much supplementation to have effect....is it working more as an anti-inflammatory? or is something messing up how our kids are getting or processing their vitamin D?


Sunscreen?

momof6
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Re: anyone using high dose vitamin D? check out this case

Postby momof6 » Sat Sep 15, 2012 9:10 am

JeniB wrote:lots of zinc supplementation without vitamin D could cause toxic levels of zinc and iron in the brain. .


See, I'm afraid that adding supplements on my own will cause damage like this if I don't know what I'm doing. I was planning on starting zinc on my older NT son because of his allergies, but I didn't know I had to add vit. d to prevent toxic levels of zinc & iron building up in his brain. I'm concerned about starting new aggressive protocols myself with Conor, but so many of you have told me not to solely rely on our DAN for guiding his recovery. How do you guys do it?


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